Daniel P. Barron

This is a continuation of a previous article.

Sara_Ks: ⁱ Daniel Please stop the personal attacks.
Daniel: I haven't made any personal attacks.
Sara_Ks: I know how to read.
Daniel: Telling someone they are going to hell is not a personal attack.
closedanger: I should have never told any of you that you are going to hell.
kissa: Daniel, do you go to hell?
closedanger: I'm sorry.
Daniel: kissa, I hope not.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, I'm afraid it is and if you were Christian, you would know only God knows that.
closedanger: I take it back and we are not there yet.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, it's not, and you are going to hell if you believe it is.
kissa: Daniel, me too ... same prospects aren't they.
james_-: Many Christians believe that telling someone else they are going to hell is an act of love, they are trying to scare them into having faith.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, I know that God says to judge is to believe.
closedanger: Sometimes GOD tells you, and that is not fun either.
Daniel: james_-, it is an act of love.
closedanger: But you are not dead yet! You are just one step away - on the IRC. lol. I guess you could think you are in hell on IRC though.
TrollT: Hm? No, this is just a batch of text.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, You don't know if someone is going to hell. You are making a judgement which God says is His. Don't make it here. Do it someplace else.
Akonyte: The only hell I know is when my woman is upset with me. ⁱⁱ
Daniel: Sara_Ks, I do know, and if you believed you would know too.
kissa: james_-, yes ... and being negative, isn't love at all..... who are we to judge, who goes to heaven or who doesn't.
Daniel: You can know who is going to hell by comparing what the Bible says to what the person does and says.
Sara_Ks: I'm not going to argue with you. Please don't make that kind of claim here.
Daniel: I will continue to make that claim here.
TrollT: I do appreciate that. It is an arrogation (judging people) that is contentious and mean. It seems like it runs contrary to the kindness Christians are enjoined to practice by the Christ.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, actually, you won't. ⁱⁱⁱ
Daniel: Wouldn't be the first false christian channel to remove me.
closedanger: They kick me all the time. I'm despised.
TrollT: Is this a badge of pride?
james_-: That website atruechurch is a real kick, it's basically a big list of everyone who's going to hell.
Daniel: I am banned from many discord servers and subreddits and IRC channels. james_-, yep.
closedanger: Really?
james_-: It's like there's only going to be about 30 or so people who have ever lived who will be saved. It's a real bummer.
Daniel: james_-, probably more than that but yeah it's not many. Most people go to hell, and this is what the Bible says; it is not a personal attack.
kissa: Daniel, are you going to hell?
Daniel: kissa, I hope not.
closedanger: Well, if you spent all this time working this universe, Whom is it GOD wants to spend Eternity with? Ever think about THAT?
james_-: That's cool, you can have your god that creates 99.999999% of all people just to send them to eternal torment.
kissa: Daniel, you are not sure? Why?
closedanger: Who do I want in MY HOUSE?
Daniel: kissa, at this moment I am saved, but I don't know what tomorrow brings. ^iv
james_-: I'm sure God wants to spend eternity with the mouth breathing, knuckle dragging, yahoos who subscribe to the beliefs of that website.
closedanger: No one has stated disposition. Just some just are not going to be there.
TrollT: I think that there is a clear demarcation of the successful Christian in that those who cleave mightily and closely to the standard laid out by the Christ in the gospels are humble and kind to others.
Daniel: james_-, what do we have wrong?
james_-: Your overall disposition and outlook on life is fundamentally flawed.
TrollT: Taking up arrogation and judgementalism does not serve the cause of love or peace-making.
kissa: Daniel, how do you know, you are saved, you have not been friendly and inviting and sharing Christ's love ...... mostly just condemning.... why would you be saved today?
james_-: It's not one or two things, it's your whole DNA ^v that is irrevocably marred.
Daniel: james_-, what do we have wrong compared to what scripture says?
closedanger: No, I want a hippie beating a drum in my face in Heaven. I really do. Until NOT.
Daniel: kissa, Christ says to preach the gospel everywhere. ^vi
Sara_Ks: Daniel, there is a flaw in your theology. When you made those claims, they were as an attack, they are a proclamation made by you. But not in love or care. I saw none of that and this makes your claims unbibilical and unacceptable. Likely you are banned in places because of this.
Daniel: How do you know I am not loving you by saying this?
TrollT: Daniel, I think that "preaching the gospel" is best done in a kind and humble tone. ^vii
kissa: Daniel, your gospel is just condemning.... it has no hope, no salvation.... !! you are not actually preaching the gospel, which is LOVE.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, I see it in your words and manner of presenting them.
Daniel: TrollT, how do you know I am not kind and humble?
TrollT: Daniel, I am not assessing your style. Pleased to meet you.
james_-: Yes, it's real good news to know that God is sending 99.9999% of everyone to eternal burning torment, that makes me want to praise the good lord in the morning over my oatmeal.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, you are wrong. I warn out of love. kissa, my gospel does have hope and salvation but most false Christians already believe in those things. I try to warn about the parts of the Bible they don't believe.
TrollT: Daniel, but I am unsure that bragging ^viii that one is expelled from numerous online groups and forae is something to crow about. It seems a counter-indicator.
Daniel: TrollT, the Bible says the world will hate me for Christ's sake. ^ix
Sara_Ks: Daniel, if you are indeed a Christian, you need to read perhaps in Philippians. You are doing what it says not to do. You make judgments without knowing enough of the person. Snap Judgement, not know motives or where they are in their lives.
TrollT: Daniel, sounds like an interesting prediction.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, I don't need to know much about a person to know they are headed for hell.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, and that is the flaw of your theology.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, prove your claim with scripture.
TrollT: Daniel, I hope your assessments are accurate.
Sara_Ks: Daniel James says (4:11), "Do not speak against one another." ^x IF you do, you must know enough of the person. James goes on to say that if your criticism is not building them up, its wrong. ^xi
Daniel: That's about fellow believers.
Sara_Ks: That's about everyone, You are to spread the good news.
Daniel: It says literally "bretheren" and "brother."
Sara_Ks: No matter who it is, when you judge someone wrongly when you assume that you know all of the pertinent facts and motives behind the person's words or actions.
Daniel: Indeed it is bad to judge wrongly; I have not done this.
Sara_Ks: Philippians 1:15 , 17 ^xii goes into this.
Daniel: It is not wrong to say "the Bible says X and you say not-X, therefor you are going to hell."
Sara_Ks: You don't know enough of these people to make that judgement.
Daniel: All I need to know is that you do not believe the whole Bible; that's all it takes to go to hell. I am not preaching out of envy or strife. I am defending the Gospel which most (if not all) people in here do not believe in.
Sara_Ks: That's a slippery slope and not biblical. You have set yourself up to be the sole judge of what the Bible says. That leads to error and if you now claim you aren't the sole judge, then you are as wrong as the people you accuse. In which case, God will judge you as you judge them.
Daniel: I'm not the sole judge. The Bible is the judge, and I show people where they disagree with the Bible which will condemn them.
Sara_Ks: If you aren't the sole judge, then how can you say you are right and they are wrong?
closedanger: When you are talking to GOD, do you assume he is also talking with you through a person sometimes?
Daniel: Sara_Ks, because I believe the Bible, and they don't.
closedanger: When you are Really talking to GOD, do you preach to HIM these things?
Sara_Ks: Daniel, you said I'm going to hell, yet I believe the Bible, you said it of others.
Daniel: You think you believe the Bible, but you don't.
TrollT: Daniel, I agree, I believe as little as possible. I don't care where people are headed. I want to show them the love of the Christ.
Daniel: For example, you think it's wrong to judge, yet the Bible says no such thing.
Sara_Ks: Then you are making a judgement against what the Bible says.
closedanger: Judge not, lest you be judged.
TrollT: "It's wrong to...." -- I am not saying this. I got a different impression about aims from the Christian gospel tales.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, I posted the verse. You don't believe it?
closedanger: Lest you be judged.
Daniel: Luke 12:

57 “Yes, and why, even of yourselves, do you not judge what is right?

Sara_Ks: And you said you believe the Bible.
Daniel: Matthew 7:

“Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you.

I want to be judged by the judgment I make, which is what the Bible says.
closedanger: Double edged sword - ruling.
Daniel: So yes, I believe the Bible in this regard.
closedanger: All this Law may be applied to you. The more reason to have less of it. This is Mitzvot. ^xiii
Daniel: Also, Sara_Ks, you are hypocritically judging me!
closedanger: You are. Don't like what you hear? kick them. Judge not. hmmm
Sara_Ks: Daniel, Corinthians says this: Therefore do not pronounce judgment before the time, before the Lord comes, who will bring to light the things now hidden in darkness and will disclose the purposes of the heart. Then each one will receive his commendation from God. ^xiv
closedanger: No one can learn anything here. When we have a real conversation at 3AM, you all have to ruin it. ^xv
TrollT: Daniel, I'm not judging you at all, just encouraging you to be loving, kind, and friendly. :)
Daniel: TrollT, if you believed you would judge.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, there ARE things we can judge AND things we can't judge. You can't judge the heart.
TrollT: Daniel, Maybe so. :)
Sara_Ks: Note Corinthians, Daniel.
closedanger: Well, I'm the Judge. Have fun with that.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, when I say "you are going to hell" I am not saying you cannot turn from this path. Please cite chapter and verse.
closedanger: Double edged sword! Does anyone know what that means here?
Daniel: Sara_Ks, I know what is in your heart because it comes out of your mouth.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, it doesn't matter, you are judging the heart and Corinthians addresses that.

Therefore do not pronounce judgment before the time, before the Lord comes, who will bring to light the things now hidden in darkness and will disclose the purposes of the heart. Then each one will receive his commendation from God.

TrollT: Sara, sounds cautionary and warning. I would prefer to witness the succor and warming support of the Christ I know. Belief or no belief.
Sara_Ks: It does, but the real meaning is to worry about what we each do, not so much what others do because we cannot know their heart.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, I know your heart, and that it is evil every day.
TrollT: Sara, That's more aligned to my own heart.
Daniel: As is my heart and everyone else's, because the Bible says every man's heart is evil every day. ^xvi
TrollT: The way you type, Daniel, sounds mean and corrosive.
Fen: Jesus' invitation to follow Him is not a jury summons. He calls us to share His gospel, not to sit in judgement of one another.
Daniel: TrollT, I am telling what the Bible tells.
TrollT: Daniel, do you care how you come across?
Daniel: Matthew 12:

34 Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

Sara_Ks: Fen, I agree. Daniel, like different leaders we know, Paul, Apollos, and Peter had different personalities. They likely had different rhetorical and pedagogical styles, theological emphases, and may have exercised or emphasized different spiritual gifts. <<<<< When you do you miss what is in the heart, the intention and the relationship the person has with God.
Daniel: Matthew 15:

18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and they defile a man.

I am judging what you all are saying, which is what comes from your heart.
TrollT: Daniel, I tend to care how people act on behalf of my God. I don't understand why you might not.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, that's true, but it's out of context. Tell us the situation in which that was said...lol or I can
Daniel: The context is on eating unclean things.
TrollT: Sara, I thought so too, that some good bit was context-less.
Daniel: Luke 6:

45 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart brings forth evil. For out of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaks.

The Bible says I can know what is in the heart by what comes out of the mouth. Sara_Ks says that I can't know what's in the heart.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, that doesn't help because you have set yourself as the judge of what is good and what is evil in a person.
Daniel: The Bible says what is good and evil; I'm telling what it says.
TrollT: Daniel, thank you for telling us what you believe about your scripture.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, so what happens if you disagree with something as to whether its good or evil?
closedanger: Thanks for saying what's up, Daniel.
Daniel: If we disagree on what is good and evil? One or both of us is going to hell. ^xvii
Sara_Ks: Daniel, the question is how YOU can make the judgement. Example.
Daniel: By believing the Bible and having the mind of Christ.
closedanger: People do not think like GOD. They think like they are paupers and mites. They should think more like GOD.
Daniel: 1 Corinthians 2:

16 For “who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him?” But we have the mind of Christ.

Sara_Ks: God commanded the Amalekites be killed. Some claim its evil, God commanded mass killing. Is it evil? By whose standard do you judge? Man can say murder is evil. No?
closedanger: They they will see what HE is doing on this earth. Curse Amalek.
TrollT: Sara, The usual argument is that the God provides the moral standard for humans to humans but does not have to abide it Himself.
closedanger: Kill every one of them immediately.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, God sometimes commands people to do evil things. ^xviii
closedanger: Kill all of the tribe of Amalek.
Daniel: God commanded Abram to kill his son.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, yes and what you hear people say can be related to their walk with God. You don't know the purpose of their walk. God does.
closedanger: Before they go back and rat us out to the Egyptians. This is not Amalek's project, this is GODS Project. Every one of them. No other tribe will try this crap with me again.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, that's why you are on a slippery slope.
closedanger: And just wait until there are Hittites.
TrollT: While I don't believe that those were historical events, the tales do include the God providing demands which supersede the ordinary moral standard. I presumed this meant that 1) what is immediately commanded was moral; 2) otherwise in the absence of the commands of the God follow the rule-set provided.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, part of "their walk" is me telling them they are heading the wrong way.
closedanger: That was EXPLICITLY demanded.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, this is the reason I don't say,"You're going to Hell." I don't know that. What I do know is I can show them love and care and share what God has to say.
TrollT: And with the proviso that what was commanded of human beings wouldn't apply to gods.
Daniel: Sara_Ks, if you loved people, you would warn them they are headed towards hell.
closedanger: These were traitors what would end Israel before Israel.
Sara_Ks: Daniel, I can't know it. That's the problem. I DO tell them to choose wisely.
Daniel: TrollT, you are going to hell for not believing the Bible when it says those are actual historical events that actually took place.
closedanger: Right after the golden calf. Kill them all. All. They were lost at MT Sinai in Saudi Arabia.
TrollT: Daniel, you're in hell now, with your behavioral standards. I am fine and not destined anywhere after death.
Sara_Ks: Got to go. Take care.
closedanger: And traded right there after less than 40 days.
TrollT: Bye Sara!
closedanger: You are fine by me, Daniel. You could see them worshiping something from MT Sinai. It is not a very big mountain. Could hear them sometimes too. Less than 40 days and they had made a new god for themselves.
TrollT: Daniel, I don't mind your dire predictions, since I don't regard you as a worthy authority in respect of my life or religion.
closedanger: Then whip them and they want to go back to Egypt and sell everyone else out because of their un-faithfulness? He was the XO. You are not the only tribe here Sir, You need to die and your whole lineage too for such an egregious sin.
TrollT: I hope you see that I am not judging or issuing such dire warnings or predictions to you.

1. Sara_Ks is a moderator of the channel. She has the power to silence and remove other users. ^
2. Proverbs 21:
   

   9 Better to dwell in a corner of a housetop,
   Than in a house shared with a contentious woman.

    ^

3. Actually, I will! ^
4. Proverbs 27:
   

   1 Do not boast about tomorrow,
   For you do not know what a day may bring forth.

   Indeed, we should not boast about tomorrow, but that doesn't mean we can't know we won't go to hell.
   

   Darwin: You should know. Ephesians 1:
   

   3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, 5 having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,

   Romans 8:
   

   28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. 29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.

   31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? 32 He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? 33 Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. 34 Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36 As it is written:

   “For Your sake we are killed all day long;
   We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.”

   37 Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. 38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, 39 nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

   Daniel: What if I’m not elect though? I should act as though I am?
   Darwin: Yes. You're not, if you don't believe you are. That's part of a believer's hope.
   Daniel: I hope I am, but okay I believe I am too. ^

5. Our genetics?? ^
6. See "There are channels for that" ^
7. How do you know what my tone is over text? ^
8. Assuming that I was bragging, rather than simply stating a fact. ^
9. Matthew 10:
   

   22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.

    ^

10. James 4:
    

    11 Do not speak evil of one another, brethren. He who speaks evil of a brother and judges his brother, speaks evil of the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge.

     ^

11. 
    

    Darwin: James 4:11 is talking about speaking evil. It's not evil to speak the truth. It's talking about wrongly judging. Condemning someone for something you think is wrong but isn't. That's why it says, "He who speaks evil of a brother and judges his brother, speaks evil of the law and judges the law." It's setting up your own standard of right or wrong.

     ^

12. Philippians 1:
    

    15 Some indeed preach Christ even from envy and strife, and some also from goodwill: 16 The former preach Christ from selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my chains; 17 but the latter out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel.

     ^

13. The 613 commandments of the Old Testament. ^
14. 1 Corinthians 4:
    

    5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord comes, who will both bring to light the hidden things of darkness and reveal the counsels of the hearts. Then each one’s praise will come from God.

    This is talking about things that can't be judged because they aren't known yet. They are "hidden things of darkness." It's not talking about things that can be known. For example, if someone says something contrary to the Bible, you can know that it is wrong, and it isn't wrong to judge it as such. ^

15. Indeed, this conversation took place around 3am, and this guy is apparently upset that we interrupted his politicking with Bible talk. ^
16. Genesis 6:
    

    5 Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

     ^

17. 1 Peter 3:
    

    8 Finally, all of you be of one mind, having compassion for one another; love as brothers, be tenderhearted, be courteous;

     ^

18. Amos 4:
    

    4 “Come to Bethel and transgress,
    At Gilgal multiply transgression;
    Bring your sacrifices every morning,
    Your tithes every three days.

    Matthew 23:
    

    32 Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt.

     ^