Daniel P. Barron

By the law is the knowledge of sin.

Saturday, September 14, 2019

This log has been modified to remove offensive language.

_fakey_: Very open-ended Q: What are your thoughts on abortion?

Daniel: It's murder.

JudoTrip:i Murder is an illegal killing. If a killing is legal, then it isn't murder.

Daniel: It should be illegal according to Scripture.

JudoTrip: What do you mean?

Daniel: Scripture says "life for life"ii in regards to the death of an unborn baby.

JudoTrip: Where?

Daniel: Exodus 21:

22 And if men fight, and they hit a pregnant woman, and her children come out, and there is no harm, he shall surely be punished as the woman's husband puts upon him; and he shall give among the judges. 23 And if there is harm, then you shall give soul for soul, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe.

JudoTrip: Haha, oh Exodus.. what a mess. Aren't Christians usually going on about how these rules are for Hebrews only?

Here are some of the craziest rules to come out of Exodus. You think this stuff should be part of the law, too?:

  • "If a man sells his daughter as a servant, she is not to go free as male servants do."iii
  • Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.iv
  • Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.v
  • Do not allow a sorceress to live.vi
  • Three times a year you are to celebrate a festival to me.vii
  • Do not cook a young goat in its mother’s milk.viii

Daniel: Indeed we are not under the law, but it is a good law nonetheless.ix

JudoTrip: What makes it a good law?

Daniel: It's the law God gave Moses.

JudoTrip: And why would that be a good law for us today? Should we bring back those other ridiculous rules from Exodus, or just the one about abortion?

Daniel: By the law is the knowledge of sin. (Romans 3:20x) The passage from Exodus reveals that an unborn child is recognized as being a live human being. It is already against U.S. law to murder.

JudoTrip: Murder is defined as an unlawful killing, and abortion is not illegal everywhere in the US, so I don't understand your point.

Should we also bring back the other rules from Exodus, or just this one about abortion? Why not the others?

Daniel: The point is, Scripture sees the fetus as a person. And yes, I'm in favor of all the rules.

JudoTrip: So you think we should bring back slavery? And children who talk [trash] to their parents should be killed?

It's a really good thing we don't run government according to the Bible. You guys have more in common with Muslim extremists than you think.

Yikes!

Daniel: Yes, those would be good things to have as law.xi

JudoTrip: Well, that's insane and would even make the Westboro Baptist Churchxii blush.

Maybe that was good and fun for the Hebrews pre-1st century, but here in modern Western civilization, we don't put children to death for their speech, and we've moved on from slavery.

Please reconsider your position.

Righteous_Dude:xiii Moderator warning: I chose to permit that comment, but saying that another person's position is 'insane' is not civil discourse.

  1. Identifies as "Atheist, Ex-Christian."
  2. Actually it says soul for soul in Hebrew, but most English translations say life.
  3. Exodus 21:
    7 “And if a man sells his daughter to be a female slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do.

  4. Deuteronomy 21:
    18 “If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and who, when they have chastened him, will not heed them, 19 then his father and his mother shall take hold of him and bring him out to the elders of his city, to the gate of his city. 20 And they shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.’ 21 Then all the men of his city shall stone him to death with stones; so you shall put away the evil from among you, and all Israel shall hear and fear.

  5. Exodus 21:
    20 “And if a man beats his male or female servant with a rod, so that he dies under his hand, he shall surely be punished. 21 Notwithstanding, if he remains alive a day or two, he shall not be punished; for he is his property.

  6. Exodus 22:
    18 “You shall not permit a sorceress to live.

  7. Exodus 23:
    14 “Three times you shall keep a feast to Me in the year:

  8. Exodus 23:
    19 The first of the firstfruits of your land you shall bring into the house of the Lord your God. You shall not boil a young goat in its mother’s milk.

  9. Psalm 19:
    7 The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul;
    The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple;

  10. Romans 3:
    20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

  11. See "Slavery."

    Darwin: In the future, they will be law (Ezekiel 43-44; Zechariah 14; Colossians 2:16-17 “shadow of things to come”; Hebrews 9:11; 10:1 “good things to come;” Revelation 19:15).

    Today: “Because the sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil.” (Ecclesiastes 8:11)

  12. See "God Hates Phelps (The "God Hates Fags" Preacher)".
  13. Identifies as "Christian, Non-Calvinist."

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